Warren Buffet and Bill Gates Interview, Buffet talks Investing Gates talks Entrepreneurship

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Warren Buffet and Bill Gates Interview, Buffet talks Investing Gates talks Entrepreneurship

Bill Gates and Warren Buffett are here gates is the co-chair of the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation the philanthropy focuses on education poverty and global health when Buffett is chairman CEO Berkshire Hathaway the company is one of the most successful companies of the last five decades the to have famously been friends for more than 25 years together they started the Giving Pledge in 2010 the initiative encourages the world’s riches to donate the majority of their wealth to philanthropic causes Buffett pledged the bulk of his wealth to the Gates Foundation in 2006 and has since given more than 24 billion to charities I am pleased to have both of them back at this table welcome and I have to say in the interest of full disclosure we just did something like this at Columbia University with a thousand students you do this before there is something special about the curiosity and the interest of young people wanting to know how do they learn from you wanted to know if you were starting over what would you do wanting to know about values you do a lot of this well about the friendship we met on July 5th 1991 and and hit it off immediately it was a little reluctant at first but he got there ya know If it wasn’t for his mother we probably know each other and we’ve had a good time ever since and and we’ve cooperated on particularly on the giving page but other things as well and and I have to say it’s everything about its turned out well he sits on your board he sits on the Berkshire Board and then and we have a lot of fun talking about a lot of things and and but the big thing that really came out of one of those discussions that really was the Giving Pledge said that that that’s worked out so much better than I ever anticipated Charlie I mean I thought the Forgotten 30 – 40 people you know what we have you I think 156 or something like that and and the people and now we’ve gone beyond the borders of the United States which I didn’t feel what originally happened and people are learning more our members about effective philanthropy they’re learning about things that doesn’t work they’re learning how people handle within their families wealthy families and it’s just it’s worked out so much better than I would have guessed six years ago or seven years both of you have made the point that they’re a lot because of success in technology there are a lot of people with a lot of money who much younger yeah it’s a great thing that these companies are doing so well and as a group I’d say it’s a particularly philanthropic group I didn’t give huge gifts until I was 45 some of them in their 30s are already doing amazing things Wow why and did you were you the word is reluctant reluctant to give early than that I’m taking the time to understand where the huge payoffs were and I was pretty maniacal about Microsoft and only in my late 30s with some encouragement from my wife Melinda did I start to study it talk with her about it we know he would do it by the time I was 60 but as we were doing that learning we decided we should accelerate it and you know we found a lot of ways that we thought we could have high impact and the principal sort of mission call was that all lives are equal that’s right and a lot of that outside the United States has gone to save lives and have kids grow up to be healthy how did you decide that you’d rather give your money to the Gates Foundation then create some foundation of your own and go out and find people to run it and do whatever you want it to do well by my first wife Susie and I actually started a foundation over 50 years ago and we we talked about it since we were in our 20s and I I always thought I’d be red she didn’t think I would do but and I said to her if I come home money at the brain I hope to compound money there will be really large sums later on it you’re good at giving it away I’m good at making it so I’ll make it first and you give it away and she thought that was sort of half a cop-out and half logical yeah absolutely so we did something like I say we started over fifty years ago but I really thought that there would be large sums later on and that she was particularly good at empathizing with people understanding their needs putting the personal energy into it everything she would be better at giving away money than I would be and she died in 2004 you know so so that I had to rethink what I was going to do and so in 2006 I decided that essentially five foundations the Bell Melinda Gates Foundation being the largest I looking for people that had similar goals with philanthropy that what I had and they the idea that every life is of equal value is just fundamental to me whether you’re lucky can be lucky and you knew good wouldn’t run it will well

of course he was I mean it’s putting he had his own money up which is a big deal but far more than that I mean yet too much younger people very bright very hard-working they work much harder at this than most people do in this country and their jobs as and they were on the same track I was on maroon quantity I mean everything about it made sense and and and its continued to make sense ten years later he’ll talk about Melinda’s influence you have said to me about Suzy your late wife I was a mess until I met I think that’s understating well I was a very lopsided not well-adjusted person who happen to be very good at one thing and and she put me together I mean that and it wasn’t it wasn’t overnight either I mean but she just had that little sprinkling can yeah you know and finally she saw us coming together of opposites or no no I wouldn’t say that we we had very similar by we were in sync they in a very big way and and but I she was way more about Oregon I wish she was nineteen one got married I was 21 but I was I was about twelve emotionally and she put me together and like I say it took time but that it changed my life I mean I would I would not have been had brought anything like the life I that and what did Charlie Munger had well Charlie Munger is my partner of 57 or 58 years and and he’s extremely wise he’s a wonderful friend we’ve been partners that time and he’s strong-minded I’m strong-minded we disagree sometimes we have never had an argument in that whole time and we never will and never had an argument I will I that’s absolutely true you must disagree absolutely we disagree but so if you disagree how do you decide to well what he says at the end is when we disagree he says well Warren you’ll end up agreeing with me because you’re smart and I’m right you know where do I attack that particular problem no I I respect his opinion enormous Lee whatever he gives it to very smart girls opinions I mean it’s but it’s a it’s more fun doing things with partners and I mean the most fun is obviously a marriage partner and that’s the most important relationship but what having having a business partner if I’d done everything I’ve done it wouldn’t worked out this way but let’s say I got double the results been more fun doing it with Charlie who says no to Bill Gates well Melinda it’s great when somebody knows you know when you might move too fast or be over-optimistic and you know if a team comes in and I’m pointing out things we haven’t done and you know maybe they’re not as motivated afterwards so you know they you know you get me to correct that item I matured a lot and I give Melinda immense credit you know she still has work to do but I think I’m getting there in complementary strengths where you share the same goal is a great thing I had that with Paul Allen in the early days of Microsoft I had that with Steve Ballmer as Microsoft got going now both in my family life and the foundation it’s Melinda how much time do you spend at Microsoft I’m there about 15% of the time and I get to work just on the RND part brainstorming with people thinking okay how we’re gonna take this artificial intelligence and make it understand help you use your time better it’s a very exciting time in software and there’s five companies that are you know in a really strong position Microsoft is leading in some really cool stuff so like I look oh the way that a business takes information about customers about communication with customers looking at data that mission of really using data and AI and getting the productivity of all those workers up because they see more information Microsoft is the leader in that and it’s a wonderful niche you know it’s a multi-million dollar niche that they’re strong in and that they will be innovating along that line more in the next two years than than ever in our history there’s a passion for artificial intelligence you do yeah it’s the minute the ultimate dream when you start working on software is the kind of deep understanding and intelligence that humans have so it’s been the holy grail of when can the computer learn to play games when can the computer learn to read when can it understand speech and things like speech and vision have made such progress in recent years I mean I

you know you’ve been tracking this and exposing your viewers to some of it because I can’t overstate that even for people in the field it’s a pretty magical time and its potential is to do what change everything well to in the first instance to be the best assistant ever to look at all your information and you know help you know in a few minutes between meetings what you should look at or when you’re trying to you know plan a trip or organize things and things to be a much much much better assistant than it is today and then eventually certain mechanical tasks like warehouse work or driving that it would take that over but for intellectual work it it will just magnify the creativity and and make your time more valuable are you interested in technology i I don’t have enough I don’t think I have a natural bent that way to start with and I’d be so far behind I never would catch up with people with that have been working on it and then they did it would not be a game I would be when I was a principal criteria for you understanding the business yeah I understand the business and there are lots of businesses that I don’t understand some of them may be almost unheard understandable and others are just outside Maya’s sphere of confidence but you do have people now that that do have that kind of expertise were there you have brought in I have two people who themselves have different circles of competence but they are chosen because they have a different circle I think there’s a lot of overlap there’s overlap between them and the important thing you know it’s not how it’s nice to have a huge circle of competence much more important know where the where the limits are of it you can do very well if you only understand 5% of the business system in the country and find plenty of Robert Ann you know which five but you’ve got the five percenter in that circle I mean you made a huge purchase in 2016 precision was bought in 2006 and we bought 37 billion dollars including that thirty three or four billion of cash and assumption about four billion of debt is it harder and harder to find an acquisition candidate because sure I mean we got to move a needle on four hundred million a market value and you know if we make a million dollars you know we’re talking a quarter one percent and that’s after tax I mean that’s more than a billion and a half pre-tax so it’s hard to find things I would do better percentage-wise if I was working with a much smaller amount of capital you find them it’s interesting that I’ve got a call I’ll be sitting thinking and I mean different different different things that in terms of buying private private businesses it’s because I got a call from a private seller but occasionally I just decide to act and and we never do anything unfriendly but in terms of buying whole businesses and people who know you and it close to you on the lookout for you or not 12 billion of common stocks since the election it’s in my mind which ones I pick now the guys that worked with me the two fellows they probably bought a little bit or so a little bit too but but those are just those are ideas that I’ve either commented from a different slant in some way or whatever it may be the airlines one of those well it was Sean I won’t tell you anything we’re selling out it was shown on September 30th that we own some airlines some stocks so why did you do that well I was part my decision no joke is as you know become a min you know start as a billionaire buy an airline there’s no there’s no question that that it’s been a graveyard for a lot of money but transportation has been something the railroads and airlines are not related and all their different kinds of businesses you can’t look you can’t move the track of who planes around and you can’t go into I mean airlines attract people just by there’s a certain romance to it like Hollywood does or something and and so you can actually go into the business and more than a hundred airlines have gone broke in on the last 20 or 25 years or something like that so it it’s a different sort of business how is knowing Bill changed or influenced our enhanced your sense of of the way the world works well I learned from him you know I like to learn from all friends and Bill happens if you have but but listen that’s the fun of having friends charlie you know I I don’t think I would be hard for me to be a friend with anyone that I don’t learn something from and a public I’ve got a board with me talk about stock mints amount you know I he wrote an article for Fortune magazine that I read

before I met him about that it’s not necessarily a good idea to leave large sums to your children so that was pretty fundamental and I remember reading that and I I was convinced that that was writing a mint Wow now you have to think of how to have it give it away I also remember Warren showing me his calendar and I love you know I had every minute packed and I thought that was the only way you could do things and you know the fact that he is so careful that there’s nothing there’s no this is the week of April of which there are only three entries for a week not to crowd yourself too much and give yourself time you read and think and write you control your time and that sitting and thinking may be a much higher priority than a normal CEO who you know there’s all this demand and you feel like you need to go and see all these people it’s not a proxy of your seriousness that you filled every minute in your schedule wanna watch your time yeah yeah that’s the only thing you can’t buy I mean I buy anything I want basically but I can’t buy time and so time is the most precious thing you can have it I better be careful with it okay there’s no way I will be able to buy more time and living in Omaha makes that easy that makes it a lot easier I 450 whatever things well then for four years I spent five minutes going each way now just imagine that was a half an hour each way yeah I know the words to a lot more songs know if you’re doing an hour a day difference coming and going and you know yes that’s two and a half percent of the person’s work week yeah that means 40 years you’re talking about a year do you agree politically on almost everything you know a general sense that you’ve got to keep the economy turning up greater output and that you have to allocate it in a fair way yeah that that basic framework we see very much the same do both you believe we can achieve a four percent growth rate that’s pretty high but we just by 2016 I think the last record it was like 1.6 or some Charlie a two percent growth rate if we have a little less than one percent population growth which we probably will in one generation 25 years now people have kids a little later well and 19,000 per capita family of four 76002 real GDP so there will be 70 friendly a four on average there would be 76,000 more stuff per family of four in one generation I mean we are gonna have more and the Golden Goose is gonna keep laying more golden eggs I mean that we’ve got a wonderful system well but but there are certain things that could could get in the way of that 2% I think a little bit oh you do two percent yeah and two percent will produce miracles yeah but three percent is probably possible didn’t it it could be but that’s but that would be fabulous right and but two percent will produce 19,000 per capita that’s greater than the existing you know a whole lot of countries that will be added the question is what we do with it how do you see the future of China well they’ve done a great job on some things they’re not a democracy and so it hangs in the balance how their political system will evolve but in terms of raising incomes getting rid of a poverty improving health it it’s an unbelievable miracle that they’re embraced in their own special way of the market since really just 1990 they’ve done very well and so they’re the second biggest economy in the world they’re serious about trade they’re serious about clean energy they are super important the most important relationship in the world is the us-china relationship clearly because of the two biggest economic powers in the world right and we’re strong and we’re gonna stay very strong yeah what could make us not stay strong there’s a lot of strength that we’ve built up over decades the way we do research our

universities the way that people take risk and that’s why our technology companies are still so strong our biotech companies are still so strong so the education system is one that you know we need to go back and look at you know and that is one huge source of inequity because if you get a great education actually the outcomes are are pretty good your mobility rate is totally your experience there’s totally there’s much harder than even you imagine improving the u.s. education system yes the dropout rate has gone down a bit so that that’s great but the overall reading scores math scores and the inequality hasn’t budged much in the last ten years and one of the goals our foundation is to working with partners change that and and so far it’s proven to be one of the tougher ones but we still believe that it’s super important and there are promising if we look at individual schools we see great things so we still believe it’s it’s achievable all the talk about immigration wants all the better but hope to talk about immigration are we still looking at a situation where some of the best and brightest from overseas come here get an education and that go back to India or China or wherever is rather than staying here well a lot do stay and the most important import the US has ever had by far is human talent it’s been to our benefit that a lot of the hardest-working best and brightest from almost every country in the world have wanted to come to the u.s. and so if you look at university departments or you know doctors engineers people starting up companies building jobs it’s been a huge strength of ours we’ve not we haven’t always made it super easy for that to work but it has worked very very well so the number going back it’s meaningful but net we are still a huge beneficiary of human talent but it used to be said and company but I think first wrote this we ought to staple a green card a big diploma yeah I believe that now is that you know a bias because I’m from the tech industry where we can create multiple jobs around the engineer instead of having to do that outside the United States yes I believe that keeping talent in the country is a great thing tell us the story because you told me the story and I didn’t know had it before you think the second most important document in America’s history after the Declaration of Independence of perhaps the US Constitution or both you know is this letter that was a lot of written by immigrants there’s a lot of written by two Jewish immigrants and and and that doesn’t sound like much nice you’re one of the names but what in August of 1939 just before Germany moved into Poland Leo’s our Lord whose name is not well known who was born in Hungary but he went to Germany and he worked in Germany with Albert Einstein and in 1933 I believe both of them left Germany and where do they come they come to the United States and they become United States citizens and they co-signed a letter to President Roosevelt the Lord got Einstein to sign him because his name carried more weight and that letter which you can see on the Internet not even a full page says Germany is gone I’m really paraphrasing in there but Germany’s going to get an atom bomb and it may work it didn’t say for sure would and and that we better get to work on one and the Manhattan Project came out of that I don’t who knows what would happened in World War two a if Hitler hadn’t been so anti-semitic you know basically he’d go out he’s doing great scientists and everything and secondly if those two hadn’t chose to come to that I’m agreed to the United States I mean the United States was you know it welcomed them and and they they may have saved this country they may have saved this country so that the Germany did not get it and we did we and all those be ones in vetoes that were locked over there in the England everything this is another right warhead from the standpoint of the German said and if we charted three years later who knows what would happen the remarkable men and they were both immigrants you sent me a note maybe a month ago and you basically said I’m not worried about the American economy that’s right I worry about is that somehow in some way will make a mistake in terms of the employment of nuclear weapons or some bad character will buy them or steal them and weapons of mass destruction around their instruction and that’s a knowledge accident maybe it’s a pewter cliff or whatever it might be it’s a tiny tiny probability in a given day but there are

people who wishes Hill there are people who would like to kill millions of Americans and and there’s there’s some psychotics there’s religious fanatics there’s you know megalomania accident I mean the world has a certain number of them and if they get in the wrong position and they have the knowledge and they have the ability there are people who would like to kill millions of Americans and the weapons are there to do it I mean when we I just find sign said shortly after after the launch of what was then called the atomic bomb he said this is I know not with what weapons World War 3 will be fought but World War four will be fought with sticks and stones and that probability exists and it’s the number one job in presidented states which every president acknowledges is to the extent possible protect us from weapons of mass destruction and they can exist with individuals but you don’t worry too much about that the intent but with organizations and maybe even with a couple of nations and it’s the only real cloud on America over time well we’ll solve the economic problems but that’s it that’s number one you agree I agree and it’s not just nuclear weapons now the bioterrorism piece is also quite daunting and what’s the bioterrorism piece well in an extreme case somebody would reconstruct say a smallpox virus and have that spread and it would not only kill millions it could potentially kill billions there was on the op-ed piece in The New York Times within the last about two years I checked with Bill because I don’t understand his stuff well enough and he said yeah I make sense that in terms of being feasible and it was basically about reconstituting smallpox I mean there are people in the world or maybe organizations probably are organizations that would love the idea of creating a smallpox epidemic and prevent them from doing that well you you want to have surveillance to catch it as soon as you can you want to have medical tools where you can create a vaccine and protect people science is working on the defense part of this at the same time it’s it’s making the offense slightly easier so if we’re vigilant there’s a lot of steps we can take to make the risk Lord just like minimizing access to fissile materials meaningfully reduces the chance of a nuclear weapon there’s some who argue that the next war will not be a nuclear war or it may perhaps not even bioterrorism it will be a cyber war that’s a a third area and I I you know I personally there’s only the three but that’s not much comfort yes the in a modern society depends on electricity and communications and information flow and if you can for a substantial period of time disrupt that then a lot of systems including how a hospital organize itself or how food gets moved around an engine ah you know or yeah an airline decides but what to do yeah or bank accounts you know what was that bank account supposed to be and so a lot of experts in government and and companies now are spending time thinking about okay how do you minimize that how do you have duplicates backup a lot of sophistication going into that can the United States risk a trade war with China or with Mexico or will that have a good idea trade benefits the problem of trade is that the benefits are diffused and invisible so you don’t walk in and buy a pair of shoes or some underwear or anything and it says you just saved 12 percent because this was purchased somebody so 320 million people are buying things the bananas come they’re buying things cheaper than they would otherwise but the the harmful effects taking somebody out of a job they’ve had for 25 years when they it’s too late to retrain everything they’re very specific and terrible now what you want to figure out a way is to keep the societal benefits and take care of the people that that really are the you know they they’re the roadkill basically in US and there will be roadkill I mean there’s no sense kidding yourself I mean we have a text we start with the textile mill at Berkshire half our workers only

spoke Portuguese you know they worked in hot conditions and loud conditions and they spent 20 or 25 years on looms when textiles moved elsewhere their lives economic lives were ruined and that is going to happen that is part of of trade and the benefits you know whether somebody buys whatever textiles we were turning out you know handkerchiefs or anything they may buy him a little cheaper and we’ve got to keep the trade benefits everybody else and them as a society it penalized a certain people terribly and we’ve got to take care of the people that are getting hurt because we’ve got the resources to take care means one what means that somehow you have to have some kind of you’ve got to have retraining and all that one that’s feasible but but it isn’t feasible when you only speak Portuguese and you’re in New Bedford and you’re 55 years old and you spent your whole life I know look you’ve got to make sure that person has an income that’s commensurate we can do it as a society and we don’t want it we don’t want to let the individual case prejudice against trading their benefits everybody but we also don’t want to say because everybody’s benefit you know to hell with this guy we’re rich we can afford that and and we should do it and that’s how we’ll get a good trade policy did you appreciate Bill the economic insecurity that was out there that Donald Trump was able to tap into politically no I I’m not an expert on political sentiment so I was no better at seeing those trends than won’t that other people it brexit in again I was surprised by the the brexit vote and the notion of the populist uprising that are taking place in a sense of feeding off of that well there’s no doubt that that young people and urban people in terms of their social mores and you know being seen to benefit relatively more from the new technology and things that are out there there is someone have been divided there the fact that that would lead to these political results is a bit of a wake-up call to say okay what is in terms of economic and social issues are you know it can we by improving medicine improving the education system can we take what the the negative views are there and and engage in a uplift their views of the future to me the greatest surprise of all isn’t how people voted because I I didn’t think of myself as having expertise on that but this general question when you say will your children be better off than you I believe their children will be better off but the fact they don’t feel that way that the improvements in health and the you know the new products that will be available to them and what technology enables them to do and all right that is a a concern because if people don’t see the arrow of time pointing towards greater things the idea of doubling down on more research and you know taking the best education and getting that that spread around it it creates a a sense of malaise where you don’t have the guidance to hey some things are working let’s do more of those things but the question is also is could America lose I mean if you look at today we have the best military have the best economy we have the best universities we have the best talent and we have the best spirit of innovation and creativity could we lose that I don’t think we would know I I think the odds of that losing that or bury this is that what you call the special sauce that’s the special sauces and and we’ve still got a special sauce if the rest of the world learns from that special sauce and you know it’s not a zero-sum game that’s terrific that is terrific but it won’t deprive us so overall in aggregate our society will be far richer 10 20 30 years ago and if you just take an aggregate our children will look better the real question is is will it continue to leave lots of people behind and in a specialized market system will leave people behind there there is if somebody is however they want to measure 10 percent below average their their opportunities in this in this world today have not improved at all you know from 30 or 40 years ago and well the classic situation is you take the Forbes 400 and 1982 number one guy was damn lucky but your viewers never they had two billion dollars you know I mean you know now that would be 30 or 40 times that I’m in 30 or 40 times and and this more highly specialized economy year after year

different from that agrarian economy of 200 years ago it’s going to be more and more people at the very top winning big big big time and it really won’t do absent certain types of programs it won’t do much for the person that really doesn’t have any special skills for the market they the the average person or slightly below average person in terms of particularly market talents it’s not going to do very well unless unless we have policies to make sure that they participate in some way and the guys at the top are gonna keep doing better farming policies from it has to be government government as always I mean the market system is this traffic cop it directs resources it directs brains and it doesn’t end it does a great job of it but if it back it also directs all the winnings that will continually favor more people at the top governments always in I mean government came in with Social Security and government you know redirects the winning so it isn’t totally in the market system that delivers the weddings but I don’t want to kill the market system in terms of producing at all we want more and more stuff but there will be more and more people falling further relatively behind and that’s not that’s not a good result I mean we can afford that we can do better and somebody I’m sure you saw this something there was a report I think last week and suggested they took eight billionaires and basically said they have more wealth than the bottom after the population in the world percent the people in this country if you took the Ford 400 they had 93 billion dollars in 1982 and they have to point four trillion now 25 times as much not exactly the same people could take the 425 times as much as 35 years ago and believe me that that does not strike somebody that’s working 40 hours a week and trying to support a couple kids on it and finding you know their incomes remain the same or be yes or they just aren’t participating they have threatened by forces they can’t compensate that they can’t the market system just pays more and more just just saying say your of junior middleweight boxer you know I mean in the 30s you were limited though you know you wouldn’t even get on the undercard at Madison Square Garden and it was limited but then television comes along and cable comes along a pay-per-view and tens and tens of millions of dollars so it’s the top it’s terrific but if you have the forty-fifth that’s middleweight in the country it’s pretty much the same as it used to be in the 30 so the spread gets wider if you’re Frank Sinatra you’re a lot better off if you’ve got television and you can just play as some theater in in New York like where you started you know it’s magnified but throughout I mean if you’ve got a good business idea you can get it capitalized and become worth billions just on the idea so it it’s just tougher whereas you know you go back to 1800 and if you were if you were reasonably strong and willing to work hard you were worth 90% as much on a farm it’s the very best guy you know it’s just the differential and it’ll keep widening the market system will push it in that direction and but it’s government is there does what would you change if I could well I would change the Earned Income Tax Credit big-time yeah I just you know I I am where I am not by myself at all I mean there’s 320 million Americans out there and there’s a lot of crosses over enormity and everything else you know but and it just I benefit enormously by having come along when I came along and where I came along hand and some people did and some people didn’t and there’s nothing wrong with all marking system that rewards anybody that makes life better for millions of people I want to get enormous ly rewarding but you got to take care of the people that that just don’t fit well into that person is I mean if this country paid off based on athletic ability you know I mean I could I could study 8 hours a day and he’s cool you know I’m still gonna you know I’m getting the ring or something like that in 10 seconds later I’m on my back you know so it the talents to get rewarded a market system are important because they bring us more of the goods and services and as the country wants then they make all kinds of improvements and how we live just incredible but they leave they leave people behind and it won’t be solved simply by education you want everybody and is it the responsibility of government to do something about this but the government you know also has to keep you know business and shape that it has the incentive to do things right and striking that balance you know should should be at the heart of political dialogues I mean nothing’s gonna work you have the fairest island in the world and two guys who are Ephesus living on it and it’s signing exactly how they should light up a palm tree and it’s the only thing on the island but it won’t make any difference so beyond national security issues when you what when you what do we have to be

fearful of in the future when we’ve talked about it some people believe there are three so intelligence all for certain kinds of risk and you’ve spoken to that that it could be get out of control and somehow you’ve spoken to that and other people have what’s around the corner that that will both benefit us or if there’s intelligence clearly one of those things too but also offers a scary world whether it is genetic gene editing or whatever that kind of well you think about these things yeah gene editing is a good one where the promise of helping with disease making plants and are more productive gene editing is you know playing with the software of life sort of the ultimate software work and yet deciding exactly how it should be used you know if you could make sure your your child was thin or you know attractive or had certain other characteristics is that a corporate use of the technology and so society will have sums of that question oh boy sure for the beta testing on that I’m serious how do you decide that government is it the whole thing about that some if there’s some balance between freedom and security and we came up in terms of you know even in terms of getting inside of a phone in which a terrorist might have left future possible terrorist acts you know well that’s another one where you know making sure the government isn’t completely bind to what goes on and financial transactions communications because you trust that the appropriate policies for when and how government’s ability to see information issues that’s another one where they’ll they’ll be a big debate about you know some extremists might say you know government really shouldn’t see anything others would say government should see everything but I think there there’s the potential for her best of both worlds of pro in fact there’s some appropriate procedure to get right we have had procedures and you know some people feel those the that even so some things went on so they you know there are voices out there that would tend towards the hey let’s not let government see things and that’s another political to question how much do we do gene-editing how much the government has disability you know we need politicians who really draw in great opinions and running a health care system and deciding when people are inventing super expensive treatments should healthcare demand so much of the economy that investing in education and social services and those things that’ll be another huge problem that will be debated in in the political arena who has health care right who’s got health care right in your judgment the European countries Indian or well the the UK spends about half as much as a percentage to GDP as the United States now their system has waiting and things like that but it’s hard to express what a mammoth different that is I mean you’re talking about almost 9% of GDP difference you know that is 1 out of 11 people who go to work every day are the extra health care activity here in the United States so I’m not saying we should just wholesale adopt their system which is a single-payer system there are other really good systems that are not single-payer systems Germany Switzerland France they do quite well it’s one of the few things access to medical care is one of the few things that we actually do quite a bit worse than other rich countries there’s some like education that a lot of rich countries don’t do a very good job on this one is is is where were to be immediately bad health care and education we don’t do it as well as other people other industrialized nations rip most rich countries don’t do that well on education and their pieces like top universities where we are absolutely the best in the world by a lot you know so that one were more middle-of-the-pack in in terms our achievement it’s healthcare access where you’d have to say we we look particularly bad is there a ticking clock on global warming yes fortunately it’s not you know overnight the really big negative impacts are in the you know 30 to 70 year time frame although it has already increased the chance of droughts and storms and you know we’re we’re seeing we’re seeing that I see a direct

causation there yes the heating effect is already there now overlaid with that are is the Pacific oscillation and normal weather things so exactly how much of it is the heating signal versus those other things you can get reasonable disagreement but there’s no doubt that that’s there the global average temperature is rising and the droughts particularly in places like the Middle East or parts of Africa we’re already seeing some of that and as you go out in time it gets a lot worse so changing the energy system which has a long lead time of invention and deployment you know I feel this is one of the most urgent problems too and it is the urgent answer finding alternative sources of energy finding that magic three characteristics reliable clean and low-cost and there’s many paths to get there and so we have to encourage lots of innovators trying different things you know if you could take Sun and turn it directly into gasoline and that would be an approach because that can be stored 24 hours a day and even moved around very well there’s approaches that involve taking nuclear to a new level of safety and a lower level of cost so that that would be a key part of the system and we need to fund a lot of innovative ideas both governments and private sector is your life today more intellectually challenging than when you were running Microsoft that’s hard to compare I I’m on a steep learning curve in both cases you know I I I love the fact that I get to meet great people I get to see things work see things that fail for this stage of my life I’m in a perfect position I couldn’t be happier because if you have an influence on Microsoft I mean not just being sorry going over to deal with it well and they you know I get to keep up to date a little bit because that and we’re using some of those digital enablement things like to get cheap financial services to poor people all over the world or to look at medical data and so staying up-to-date on the digital piece helps me do my foundation work I mean you’ve said something akin to this you know the average person today lives better than John Deere Rockville did when he was alive that is true the richest man in the world yeah yeah that’s better yeah you look better and then in terms of your entertainment choices your travel choices sub and Johnny couldn’t buy them you know I mean and that was that’s in one lifetime that it’s amazing what brings you the most satisfaction beyond family well most satisfaction is just staying in good health so you good health every day I enjoy what is it that you enjoy well I enjoy running Bircher I mean if you get right down into my psyche I mean ya know it’s it’s you know it it’s been my painting for 50 some years I get to paint what I want I don’t have to I don’t have to do you know follow what Wall Street is telling me to do next quarter or something I got so I own the brush I own the canvas and the campus is unlimited and that’s a that’s a pretty nice game and I get to do it every day with people I like I don’t have to I don’t have to associate with anyone that causes my stomach to churn you know if I were in politics I’d have to smile a lot of people it’s really I’ve got a good deal Brooke I want to say to me I spent too much of my life worrying about what people thought of me and then I only care about what I think of them yeah and my business is I’m lucky that way I mean business business is so much easier than philanthropy fly to be human may be a whole lot more important but in business you’re looking for kind of easy choices you’re looking for people that you can that you like to associate with and I mean you’re to an extent I can create the world around machine I mean if somebody walked in your door and they offer they want you to buy their company and you saw it as a golden golden goose Ramaiah with a farmer I would say no you’d say no you know you knew it would Charlie marrying for money is probably a bad idea under any circumstances but if you’re already rich it does not make any sense at all but but the satisfaction I mean what’s the metric of satisfaction it’s really

doing a decent job of running a place that yeah that it’s harder to do because of the size of it over time but it’s it’s it’s working with a whole lot of people on interesting it’s like gene McCarthy said I think about being a football coach it I mean it’s just difficult enough to make it interesting learning things and making breakthroughs you know after all the great family stuff that is a lot of fun every once while if if something really makes sense and you can teach people about it sharing insight I think that’s also very satisfying you know when I sit down with Melinda to write the annual letter the idea of okay I’ve had a chance to see things what could I share that is really succinct that might be helpful to people that that is fun it’s hard you know it doesn’t happen all the time but between my learning and being able to share where I see oh this is really simpler than I thought it was that gives me a great satisfaction to Julia now at 86 I mean I I’ve seen a lot of people have gotten older and I’ve never seen anybody that is 70 or picking pick an age who felt good about their children that told that about their life you know and all my experience I mean I’ve never seen anybody who felt good about their children and that also felt bad about their life and I’ve seen plenty of people want some money that or it hasn’t worked out well in the family and feel good about that true and well or the children didn’t feel good about them whichever way I mean but it there was it they failed at the most important teaching job they have and personal relationship and and sometimes happens for extraneous reasons but but I would I really have never met anybody regardless of their economic circumstances who felt our life was a failure the healthy baby children had been calm they loved their children and the children were doing yeah absolutely they felt good about what that you know that brought him into the world one night I felt like they hooked themselves for the viella I I knew one fellow was extraordinarily rich he put a lot of money in just kid’s name he didn’t didn’t want them to have any control over and once a year he would have dinner with him and trying to get him to sign their income tax return at blank now just imagine that you know with in this case four kids none of them wanted to have enough confidence in them or to have it’s just crazy I mean they he would wall him during this dinner and they knew exactly what was going on at once a year and the you know and then he bribe them sort of to sign their income tax return on buying so he could file and they wouldn’t know what they had I mean that when you have adult I’ve seen just time after time when people have been successes I’ve seen plenty of the other two but but successes at business of failure and I don’t think they feel like good about life thank you for coming thank you can see Bill thank you very much Oh Gates and Warren Buffett for the hour thank you for joining us